My Russian teacher, claims that when pronouncing "часá" it should be pronounced as: "чi-сa" with an "i" instead of an "a". I have looked around and it appears that the pronunciation hinges around: "cha-sa". You are native Russian speakers and could perhaps tell me what is correct and what is a myth.
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1That depends on stress. Unstressed vowel (as in полчасá) is reduced, stressed one (as in и чáса не прошло) not.– MattOct 7, 2015 at 9:14
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Большое спасибо.– AnaOct 7, 2015 at 17:39
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3 Answers
Your teacher is absolutely right. According to the rules of pronunciation of the Russian unstressed vowels,
the letter
aafterчandщin an unstressed syllable is pronounced as the letterи, that is as [ɪ].
Have a look:
часы́ - [t͡ɕɪˈsɨ] 'clock'
часовóй - [t͡ɕɪsɐˈvoj] 'sentry'
щавéль - [ɕːɪˈvʲelʲ] 'sorrel, dock (plant)'
счастли́вый - [ɕːɪˈslʲivɨj] 'happy'
That is why the word часá is pronounced as [t͡ɕɪˈsa].
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So a majority of the references out there are completely obsolete including my "russian textbook".– AnaOct 7, 2015 at 9:13
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Совершенно верно. Можно послушать машинный голосовой синтез translate.yandex.ru/… Синтез, как известно, составляется статистически, но основе анализа большого массива непроизвольной речи. По этой же причине, непроизвольности-нарочитости, сайты типа Forvo это зло.– AvtokodOct 7, 2015 at 10:05
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5Your teacher seems to be right, but it depends on the "dialect". Some people articulate this as "a", some - close to "i". But never-never try to pronnounce a clear "i". It's something average between "a" and "i". I am an urban native speaker.– PaulOct 7, 2015 at 10:43
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1@Ana it is not that the teacher from some dialect area. It is that the teachers are taught to use this way of instruction. When I was learning English I also was taught by teachers a lot or wrong stuff. I personally would distinguish чисы from часы in speach and never pronounce it as чисы either. It is even more likely that I would pronounce it as "чесы".– AnixxOct 7, 2015 at 16:47
Do not think of a vowel reduction as simply a vowel "replace". Honestly, every time when I see a phonetic transcription, I can't believe that it's the same what I speak.
Actually, the rule of reduction is really simple: speak neither чi-са, nor ча-са, nor че-са, but ч-са, where the dash stands for "some noise" left between spelling ч and с. No speaker really cares if it's closer to one vowel or another. Just do it quick and never stress.
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«Иканье … в настоящее время является орфоэпической нормой русского литературного языка наряду с допустимым еканьем». Oct 7, 2015 at 10:27
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1@YellowSky Норма нормой, а живой язык - это живой язык. Все мы периодически и "екаем", и "окаем". Человек же просто изучает русский язык как иностранный, а не готовится работать диктором на телевидении.– MattOct 7, 2015 at 10:43
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То есть, вы хотите сказать, что, изучая язык как иностранный, не нужно учить его норму? Oct 7, 2015 at 11:13
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@YellowSky Я думаю, что нормы бывают разные. А в том, что касается произношения, излишняя близость к норме вообще вредна - будешь выглядеть или как советский диктор, или как американский шпион :-)– MattOct 7, 2015 at 11:50
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2То, что вы говорите, это то же самое, как если бы американец советовал русскому не учиться говорить «going to», «want to» и «let me», а настаивал бы на том, что все говорят «gonna», «wanna» и «lemme», и так и нужно говорить, а если говорить по норме, то его за ненормального будут принимать. На самом деле всё зависит от приоритетов: если человек собирается общаться только с гопотой, то ему, естественно, норму знать не надо, но если человек собирается общаться с по-настоящему образованными людьми, то именно норму ему изучать и следует. Oct 7, 2015 at 12:12
As a native speaker, I can assure you it definitely is pronounced as "cha-sa". And I really can't pinpoint the myth origin.
Update:
Considering that a in ча can be both stressed and unstressed, it really is pronounced differently depending on stress. But it's still is pronounced as a, not as I. It's just less opened and bright.
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2You can't assure me - I've been studying Russian for four years and I have yet to hear anyone say cha-sá. I've only ever heard chi-sá, chi-sóv, etc.– CocoPopOct 7, 2015 at 13:17
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@CocoPop this synthesizer speaks a and it sounds totally correct. translate.yandex.ru/…– AnixxOct 7, 2015 at 16:40
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I can second that one. The yandex must be used by a lot of russians/russian speaking users so it has a much better selection of words and pronounciations. There are only a few minor words that I run into that are not fully pronounced but the yandex one is the best so far. I have used many others and they are a total disaster compared to yandex. I also got the impression that the yandex is much "cleaner" pronounciation.– AnaOct 7, 2015 at 16:52
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2@Anixx - Your synthesizer says [t͡ɕɪˈsɨ], and that's totally correct. Oct 7, 2015 at 19:29